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Speaking to a capacity crowd of 330 in the Hanover Inn Ballroom and another 200 viewers watching , former Vice President Mike Pence on Thursday urged a return to civility in politics and stood by his decision not to endorse his onetime boss, former President Donald Trump, for the presidency. 

But as a conservative, Pence said, he could “never” vote for Democrat Kamala Harris, his successor as vice president, either. He did not disclose how he will mark his ballot next week. 

“I’m staying out of it because I’m concerned about the direction of the Republican Party,” said Pence, the  2024-2025 Class of 1930 Fellow. “I feel like the party—some voices in our party—are starting to pull back from supporting our allies, notably in Eastern Europe, and that they’re marginalizing the right to life.” 

Pence, who ran unsuccessfully for president at the start of the GOP primary cycle, was the seventh in ���϶ij�’s 2024 Election Speaker Series, co-sponsored by the Rockefeller Center and ���϶ij� Dialogues.

Pence advocated for shrinking the national debt, boosting defense spending, overhauling entitlement programs, and reforming the civil service system in a way “that allows greater flexibility for an incoming administration, whether it’s Republican or Democrat, to staff these agencies with people that share and will move on the agenda that they were elected to advance.” 

Though he rarely mentioned Trump by name (calling him, at one point, “my former running mate”), Pence said he was “incredibly proud of the record of the Trump-Pence administration with regard to our national defense, with regard to pro-growth policies, energy, of course, the Supreme Court and judicial appointments.” Despite his sharp differences with Trump over the Constitutional duties he performed by certifying the results of 2020 election after the Jan. 6 attack on the Capitol, Pence said he believed part of Trump’s “enduring appeal” is his ability to tap into the “great frustration of the American people.” 

The lively discussion was moderated by , the Robert Clements Professor of Democracy and Politics; , associate director and senior policy fellow at the Rockefeller Center and a research assistant professor of government; and Emma Wolfe, former vice president of government and community relations at ���϶ij� and now chief of staff to the president of New York University. 

Recalling his entry into politics, first as a six-term member of Congress, next as Indiana’s governor, and then as the nation’s 48th vice president, Pence, once a Democrat who voted for Jimmy Carter, rooted his political philosophy in his unwavering Christian beliefs paired with reverence for the Constitution. 

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Former Vice President Mike Pence responds to questions from, left to right,  government professor Russell Muirhead, Emma Wolfe, and Rockefeller Center Associate Director Herschel Nachlis. (Photo by Eli Burakian ’00)

“For me, it all really begins with a foundation of faith, and principle, and then partisanship,” he said. “I’m a Christian and a conservative and a Republican, in that order.”

 About the Jan. 6 insurrection, Pence painted a chilling picture. 

 “I wasn’t afraid, but I was angry, looking at people smashing windows in the Capitol, looking at people climbing into the seat of our government, the ‘People’s House,’” he said. “I found myself thinking, no, not this, not here, not in America. And I’ll tell you that January 6th was a tragic day. But because of the courage of law enforcement, because of their resolve, I believe it became a triumph of freedom, when we reconvened the House and the Senate on the very same day and we finished the people’s work for the peaceful transfer of power using the Constitution of the United States.”

Always genial, sometimes wry, Pence shared a few highlights from his personal life, such as the joy he felt when, after struggling with infertility, he and his wife Karen welcomed the first of their three children into the family. Asked how he “unplugs” from stress, he named his favorite hobbies: horseback riding and, perhaps less predictably, playing video games, saying, “I’m a gamer.”

“Like Xbox,” he said. “I’m talking Madden and talking golf. When I was vice president, at least one hour on a Sunday, if I could catch a moment after church, I would try and put my feet up and play whoever the Colts were playing. You Patriot fans. I’ll tell you. We feel your pain.”

Although he described himself as competitive, Pence returned frequently to the idea that partisanship need not be vicious, and his conviction that everyday Americans are not as deeply divided as the politicians they elect. 

“Democracy depends on a heavy dose of civility,” he said. “I’m a conservative, but I’m not in a bad mood about it, right? I believe what I believe, but I’d fight to the death for your right to believe what you believe, or nothing at all. And I honestly think that we would do well as a nation to return to that principle of freedom and mutual respect.” 

To young people in the audience, especially those considering careers in public service, Pence offered encouragement and advice.

“First and foremost, speak your dreams,” he urged. “And I would tell anyone, whatever your politics are, secondly, just show up.”

That clarion call resonated with several students, regardless of their ideological leanings. 

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A former congressman and governor from Indiana before he served as vice president, Mike Pence encouraged students to enter public service and spoke with several after his ���϶ij� talk. (Photo by Eli Burakian ’00)

Nicholas Booth ’27, who joined a line to greet Pence following the presentation, said they’re wide apart on some issues, including Pence’s opposition to abortion and gay marriage. But he described him as a “remarkably fluid speaker, good at telling stories and narratives.” 

Malcolm Mahoney ’26 liked Pence’s emphasis on family and shares his fears about the national debt. “As somebody who’s a fiscal conservative, I’m really worried about it. I think everybody who’s a young person should be worried about it,” Mahoney said.

Elise Tong ’27 found the conversation “intriguing” and appreciated Pence’s sense of humor even though she didn’t agree with everything he said.

“His point about dedicating more of the GDP to supporting the military is something that I don’t really agree with, since as data shows, the U.S. is spending more than the next nine countries are spending on defense, combined,” Tong said. 

Muirhead, whose class Pence visited earlier in the day, was struck, above all, by his unwavering faith in the strength of American democracy. 

“I think that the major point of his presentation tonight was that we need to look past next week,” said Muirhead. “We need to take the long view. Former Vice President Pence is really not, in a weird way, worried about the election next week. Almost everyone else in the country is thinking about nothing else. And none of us knows what’s going to happen. And he’s saying, whatever happens, this country is going to be great. It doesn’t need to be made great again. It’s going to be great, regardless.” 

The speaker series continues on , the John H. Watson, Jr. Professor of Law at Harvard School of Law; ; and .

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���϶ij� is offering a —ranging from a discussion panel to walks in the woods—to help community members process the results.

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